Results and comments from the Aug/Sep 2003 survey.

	Ýves’ big SCA rapier survey #1 ~ “Let’s do more than just fence” (lists and melees)
	Updated: May 24, 2005

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Policy blurb

By default, authors of comments sent in response to this survey are named only by their permission. Usually, other people mentioned in a comment are named only with their permission as well. Each comment represents only what the author typed in for the survey at the time.

» This survey was conducted during August-September 2003. Things change over time. «

Some comments were edited for content. Certain harsh words have been changed for your amusement. Opinions expressed by the authors do not necessarily reflect those of the surveyor.

To get YOUR name listed with YOUR comments, just give me permission. See the e-mail button and information at the bottom of the page. Let me know your SCA name and kingdom (as of Aug/Sep 2003), and I'll add the attribution to your entries.

# of Responses
by Kingdom
 
AEth.  = 34/235
Anst.  = 36/240
An Tir = 56/347
Art.   = 12/124
Aten.  = 27/460
Atl.   = 60/425
Caid   = 49/400
Drach. = 21/76
Eald.  = 12/77
East   = 46/480
Loch.  = 22/120
Mer.   = 27/140
Mid.   = 52/640
Nor.   = 25/164
Out.   = 26/214
Tri.   = 46/237
West   = 14/70
Unk.   = 2

The gist

The comments below were sent in response to Question 2 and Question 3.

Respondents share their input on lists, tourneys, melees, and melee scenarios. You can also learn about the Lava Otters.

The comments

Note: Any remarks in the comments below from Yves look like this.

Other comments on this topic are on separate pages.
See the links at the bottom of this page.
 

Choice picks

Φ Nor. ~ Personaly, my fav. is every man for him/herself, last man/woman standing takes all, open melee field. That gets my juices flowing, I love it, as orgasmic as good sex!  ``Gabrielle

Φ Caid ~ More tournaments with multiple fighters vs one. Everyone knows that the tournament skill set is much different than the war fighting skill set, but the multiple vs one is a skill much neglected.  ``Tora

Φ Caid ~ I write my scenarios so that teams are encouraged to play to scenario, rather than just killing the other side. (i.e points for captures, penalties for killing certain individuals/the whole team, etc). Additionally, I prefer a war to have a connected story/strategic purpose, so that a team may lose pointwise, but have accomplished their goal. so everyone can 'win'.  ``Curteis

Φ Out. ~ BTW, all melée scenarios should be tactical, but too much emphasis on melée combat is bad - individual skill and training deserve at least 50% of our attention, and I'd prefer more (though I know people who feel otherwise). (Tactical scenarios for individuals do not sound very practical, so I assume you mean for melées.) Scenarios that require at least a modicum of thought and/or preparation are vastly preferable to simple "line up and kill them all" melées.  ``Guillaume

Lists & tourneys

Φ Atl. ~ At events (and practices for things like events, like melees), the extra stuff makes it more fun. And having things besides just a single, double, or triple elim. tourney makes life much more interesting :)  ``Costanca

Φ Caid ~ If there is fencing I'm for it. I have as much fun with a "silly" scenario as I do with tactical battles. My least fave is the standard Double Elim. but that's because I'm a lousy fencer.  ``Meala

Φ East ~ Repeating the same styles of fencing/tourneys gets dull after a while. Variety is a good thing!  ``Maire

Φ Mer. ~ I think that at best we are currently doign the right amount of special tournies. I feel that we are over looking the straight forward tourney that makes one a better fencer. The only time we get together it has to be something special and it really gets to be too much.  ``Leon

Φ Mid. ~ I hate silly mundane tournaments (Double Elim, Single Elim, etc).

Φ Tri. ~ I coordinate one tournament a year for my shires bi-annual event that is purelt schtick. Lasy year is was the KWO (Knowne World Order) Smackdown tag-team Rapier Tournament. Smashing success. This year it will be Super Heroes vs. Super Villians. Good fun. He he he.  ``Cillian

Melees & scenarios

Æthelmearc

Φ I like scenarios that challenge the fencers in ways other than what a double-elim tourney would.  ``Miguel

An Tir

Φ Silly scenarios...I am assuming that these are scenarios that could not have happened in period...rather than a scenario based on, say, a jealous lover enters the room occupied by you and your paramour, and you must fight your way out... or something else to the effect of a good Three Musketeers scenario.  ``Gwydion

In this survey, "silly" scenarios are whatever one considers to be "silly".
For those interested, I have another version of the above scenario on this site...

Ansteorra

Φ Pikes for melee combat.

Φ I view unusual scenarios as a challenge of my skills. If I were to get into an upredictable situation where I had to fight for real, creative thinking and experience dealing with the unusual and unexpected would be good skills to have developed. If the scenario is silly or ludicrous then it just keeps it fun and interesting. I do not like to do this as most of my fencing but occasianlly it is ok.  ``Claire

Φ The biggest thing to keep out of a melee, any melee, is marshals who do not have melee experience. They need to understand the differences between melee and tournament, any special rules involved, MAINTAIN CONTROL OF THE FIELD in the event of tempers flaring, rhino hiding, use of out of bounds areas to unfairly limit attacks (i.e. when legged, draging yourself to a tree on the out of bounds line and falling backwards to avoid shots and calling any shots that hit you on your torso while it is 'out of bounds' not good) and generally be aware that calling a hold on a melee field because of some percieved danger (broken blade, armor tear, etc) will happen MORE often than on a tourney field and that the marshal MUST call that hold when they see something unsafe and/or in violation of the rules regardless of who is doing it.

Atenveldt

Φ [I'm against] Unnecessary HOLDS during combat & breaks in Res. Battles.  ``Rurik

Φ It seems that the tactical scenaeios are set to be so specific that you are not allowed to use any brain matter to try to use your own tactics. The people who set up the scenarios want everything to happen the way they imagine that it will. If someone has an idea that goes against their original theory on how a specific scenario should work they try to shoot it down before you can use it.  ``Sebastiana

Atlantia

Φ My favorite are "thinking" scenarios, like puzzle or quest scenarios. either that or bear pitt :D

Φ I'd like to see more grand melees (either everyone for themself or one side against the other) and more two and three person melees. I really like the tournamnets and scenerios that are set up to even out the skill levels of the fighters playing, and that provide plenty of fighting for those who want it.  ``Ihsan

Caid

Φ More melees!  ``Eogan

Φ Scenarios should be realistic to the weapon form- large street combats, inside buildings, etc. Field battles are silly- we would see massed combined arms (pike shot, etc) for that.  ``David

Φ "Silly" is rather vague -I have another term but it doesn't bear printing. The "silliest" scenario I've been in had both sides gathering roses... My team ignored the roses and killed all the enemy- Then we gathered roses. There is nothing like killing some fool tyro trying to fence with an arm laden with faux flowers.  ``Vladimir

East

Φ Especially, tactical scenarios... the rapier woods battle at Pennsic, for example.  ``Jeanne

Φ I'd like more variety in weapons. Specifically, I'd love to see pikes so that we can experiment with combined arms melees.

Lava Otters

Φ A practice I attend features all of that, upon occaision, when they do melee games. Capture the flag/stick, immortal ogrs (just ask about the lava otters), marshalls with rubber band guns and puckish senses of humor, banter.

I asked. Here's the response.

... a very silly phenomenon limited, one hopes, to a small area of the East Kingdom. The melees feature fencers varied in skill from unauthorized to dons. Rather than have the dons be bored and because the melees are all in fun, the dons who are playing (we have one or two who usually marshal the melee, ... with rubber band guns in the second or third melee) split into their own team. The lava otters do not usually initiate attacks but will interfere and join a lopsided fight on the side of the outsided person. They also have unlimited resurrections, (this gets annoying when the other teams have limited resurrections), but have to fall down (into the lava) and roll on their backs before they get up again, to take revenge on the person who killed them. It's all in fun and to promote silliness.  ``Richild

Meridies

Φ melees24

Φ Tactical Scenarios are okay, if they're street scenarios. The fort battles get to be too unrealistic.

Midrealm

Φ Melees RULE!  ``Purple

Φ I like it all, the more varied the senario's the more fun it is.

Φ I really like scenarios. They give the melee more of a "real" feel. I also really like the parrying items (I even have a hand made plush fish :>)  ``Lydia

Northshield

Φ Prowess only scenerio's.  ``Cy

This was sent in response to Question 2. He prefers scenarios that call for more than just fighting ability.

Trimaris

Φ I think this would give more of a period flare to things, especially if the scenarios were VERY rapier relevant rather htan just a line vs. a line ("capture the flag" kinda thing).  ``Gavine

Withheld

Φ ... in most melee conflicts or 'wars' the fighters would use heavier blades to cleave armour, leather, flesh, and bone - so using fencing weapons to recreate a ship boarding is pure imagination!

Tactics

Φ An Tir ~ I would really like to see scenarios based on tactics and warfare, there are only a few notable households that utilize them well in formation on the battlefield.  ``Draven

Φ Mer. ~ Tactical scenerios can be fun but for the most part I like to fence.  ``Irene

Φ Nor. ~ The Tactical scenarios, those are my favorite.  ``David

Φ West ~ I think mass tactic should be use more. They were use in period times with rapier and we can learn a lot from them.  ``Tallon

Your feedback is most welcome!

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Original page posted: October 18, 2004. Last tweaked: July 1, 2006.

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