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Using a table format to run a list |
Updated: 29 May 2007 |
This is an article on using a table format (or grid format) instead of a tree format to run an elimination list in a tournament. Double-elimination tourneys are often run using a tree and often involve what are known as "bye fights" - in which someone still in the tournament bouts against someone who is not.
The table format very rarely requires bye fights.
Would you like to run a tourney with no bye fights . . . ?
Testimonial
Lord Yves de Fortanier deserves commendation and much good single malt scotch (or the beverage of his choice) for his website at the Rotunda detailing the Table Method for running lists. When I was first thrust into the job of running a list, a dear, dear friend taught me this method for running a double-elimination tourney and it saved my novice backside. I highly recommend that anyone considering running lists regularly learn this style. It allows for far greater flexibility than any tree. Lord Yves has done an absolutely fabulous job describing the style and providing examples of how to use it in real life situations. Go. Read. Learn. I can't stress this enough. Really.
Aine ingen MaelPatraic
Jaravellir, Northshield
Thanks, Aine. I hear scotch and mead can mix quite well, but I'll stay with cordials and dessert drinks in which I can't taste the alcohol... (Update: I had the pleasure of meeting Aine in person at KWAR in December 2007!)
Counterpoint
As we run lists {in another kingdom}, the intention is to make sure that all fights are assigned randomly - that fights are not assigned by a person, as this allows that person the ability to manipulate the tournament. For example, if I know that fighter X is inexperienced against Polearms and I am choosing whether fighter X should fight fighter Y (who uses Polearm) or fighter Z (who uses sword and shield) - regardless of which decision I make I am manipulating the tournament in some way, either for fighter X's benefit or to their detriment.
In your format "picking which fighters to have face each other again is just one of those command decisions that you get to make. Marshals who know the fighters involved may be able to advise you to make a good choice". While this may not be a problem in some cases, it does have the potential to lead to undue manipulation of the tournament.
Received via email, April 2007.
The table format works just fine with single-, double-, even triple-elimination lists. The examples I present use double-elimination, since that's the most common in the SCA.
I learned about list keeping in the SCA, so the term I use for the competitors is fighters.
The number of bouts required for a standard double-elimination list is 2F-1 (where F is the number of fighters), if no one drops out unexpectedly. In some truly rare cases, you may actually need a number of bouts that equals 2F.
The links below go to the pages with the examples. They are intended to be read in order because the later examples have less explanation.
Example 1: Eight fighters, double-elimination.
Example 2: Eleven fighters, double-elimination.
Example 3: Nine fighters, double-elimination, one fighter has to drop out unexpectedly . . . in the middle of the tourney. Truly, this is NOT a big deal when using a table format.
Example 4: Twenty-six fighters, double-elimination, taking into account what order the bouts finish in to try to give fighters a more equal time of rest between bouts. Also, one fighter has to drop out unexpectedly somewhere in the middle (as in Example 3) AND one fighter is allowed to enter the tourney after the first round, taking a loss as a penalty.
Live example #1: Sword and Mistletoe (Dec 1999). Used the table format for 30 fighters that I ran as a 16-person list and a 14-person list concurrently.
Live example #2: Lusty Month of May (May 2005). There were 18 fighters. I ran this solo. Felt a little rushed again.
Your feedback is most welcome. Would you like to send me email?
Original page posted: November 23, 1999 • Links tested: January 1, 2011 • Last
tweaked:
April 20, 2009
The address for this page is [ www.therotunda.net/heraldry/table-format.html ]
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